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family dynamics

  • S

    Anger Without Attack. Anger Without Attack:

    Anger as a Relateful Force for Intelligent Action

     

    Abstract

     

    A common psychological belief suggests that beneath anger lies sadness, implying that emotional maturity involves dropping anger in favor of grief and acceptance.  While this can sometimes be the healthiest course of emotional evolution, I argue that this framing is frequently overused and can be a form of bypassing–one that neutralizes a vital energy of action-taking.

     

    This article explores anger as a necessary, protective, and prosocial force when done in a Relateful way.  Drawing on Relational Life Therapy (RLT), developmental psychology, and applied relational practice, I propose that the task is not to eliminate anger, but to temper and aim it.  Immature anger leads to attack by following impulsive whims; suppressed anger leads to withdrawal and loveless relationships.  Mature anger enables intelligent action: action oriented towards goodness for self, loved ones, and even the target of our anger.

     

    I outline practical methods for working with anger, including clarifying positive goals, softening excess intensity to get to manageable levels through empathy, and removing language that causes defensiveness while becoming more influential.  Particular attention is given to romantic relationships in which one partner avoids anger to keep the comfort, which inadvertently reinforces harmful patterns from the other partner.

     

    Rather than framing sadness as the “truth beneath anger,” this paper positions anger as a signal of violated values or unmet needs–one that, when used skillfully, supports healthier relationships and creates more goodness in the world.

     

    —-—-

     

    Author Information

     

    Author: Shane Orton

    Background: Relatefulness facilitator; experience in personal development, therapeutic models (RLT, NLP, NARM), and meditation practices (Mindfulness, Vipassana, Metta, Heart Coherence Technique, Focusing by Eugene Gendlin)

    Affiliation: Relateful

    Contact: shaneorton12@gmail.com

     

    ———

     

    Introduction: Is Sadness Really Underneath Anger?

     

    A commonly repeated phrase in emotional work is that underneath anger is sadness.  There is truth here, but also a risk.

     

    When we stop trying to change a situation or influence another person, we may indeed find grief–an energy of accepting reality.  We mourn what we cannot have.  At times, this is not only appropriate, but necessary.  For example, if we are angry at our father, but he has passed.

     

    This is often misapplied because sadness can have us more well-liked than when we are angry.  In many cases, moving prematurely into sadness functions as a form of emotional bypassing–one that dissolves anger when action is needed.

     

    If our child is being attacked, parental anger is not something to let go of, but something to mobilize.  It’s when the impulses that anger brings aren’t helpful that anger is made out to be the bad guy.

     

    The question is not whether anger is good or bad, but whether it is utilized with mature handling.

     

    ———

     

    The Function of Anger: Action-Taking

     

    Anger exists to signal violation and mobilize energy toward change.  The energy of anger is not only useful, but essential–provided it is regulated and focused.

     

    The problem is not the energy of anger itself.  The problem is when the impulses of anger are allowed to reign while the wiser self is unclear of how to aim towards goals of goodness.  The impulses want to attack, the wiser self wants to influence.

     

    Healthy anger:

    • Has a clear purpose
    • Is directed toward protection or change
    • Does not give in to impulses to humiliate or destroy

     

    The goal is not to eliminate anger through resignation, but to bring it to a manageable level so that it can be used for intelligent action.

     

    Intelligent action means acting with clarity and intention–not using anger as a weapon, but as fuel.

     

    ———

     

    Why Sadness Is Often Chosen Over Anger

     

    Why do people try to default to sadness rather than anger?

     

    One reason is likeability.  Many people experience themselves as controlling, hurtful, and less influential when angry while they are more persuasive when they are sad.  

     

    Another reason is the safety of keeping relationships.  Anger risks burning bridges, which is especially scary when relating to a romantic partner.  Sadness, on the other hand, invites care.

     

    Choosing sadness isn’t always wrong.  I am arguing that it is sometimes overused, especially when anger can be the healthier choice.  For example, in Relational Life Therapy (RLT), they often nudge the partner that chooses to bypass anger to instead use it for the good of the relationship before the relationship becomes loveless.

     

    The cost of bypassing anger is inaction–when action is what the situation calls for.

     

    ———

     

    Clarifying Anger: Aiming the Goal Toward Goodness

     

    A Relateful approach to anger begins with looking inward to see the goodness in its intention.

     

    Before acting, look for:

    • What value(s) am I protecting?
    • What do I want them to know?
    • What do I want changed?
    • Who is this action for?  (Me?  A loved one? The relationship?)

     

    When the goal is clear, the task is to stay loyal to the goal rather than the impulse to harm, insult, or control.

     

    Anger can come with destructive impulses.  These impulses are survival instincts and are not trustworthy on their own.  The energy is useful; the impulses are not.

     

    ———

     

    Softening Anger Without Losing it: The Role of Empathy

     

    When anger becomes too intense to use cleanly, it can be softened with empathy.  The intention is not to erase anger, but to bring it to manageable levels.

     

    Empathy does not mean excusing improper behaviors or giving up on taking action.  It means seeing the humanity of the target of your anger so that your response is more informed and influential.

     

    For example, if someone is behaving narcissistically, you might imagine them as a child who received false empowerment–undeserved praise with poor parental guidance.  This does not mean pity or forgiveness, but provides context that can allow more maturity in our anger.

     

    Contexts increases influence.

     

    When we understand where a behavior comes from–even if we made up the reasons for a behavior ourselves–we can act more strategically than reactively.

     

    ———

     

    Relational Life Therapy (RLT): the Cost of Suppressed Anger

     

    RLT offers a useful lens here.  Oftentimes, RLT finds that one partner is suppressing anger in order to keep things comfortable.  This usually backfires.

     

    The partner who avoids anger creates a dynamic where the other partner can continue harmful behaviors without consequence.  This may keep the relationship in the short-term, but often leads to less love from the harmed partner, which leads to a loveless relationship.

     

    RLT encourages the less empowered partner to tap into their anger to speak up, name the bad behaviors, and create discomfort–risking the relationship in order to heal the relationship.

     

    Discomfort, in this way, is not cruelty, but a path back to love and healing.

     

    When comfort is removed, change becomes necessary.

     

    ———

     

    Anger Without Insults: Unblocking Influence

     

    One practical rule dramatically increases the effectiveness of our anger: remove insults.

     

    The impulse to call someone an idiot, jerk, or child is understandable–especially when we want the other to feel the pain we’re feeling.  However, it creates defensiveness more than invites openings for influence.

     

    Instead:

    • Name the behavior you dislike.
    • Name the impact it has.
    • Give an alternative behavior that aligns with their desires.

     

    For example, rather than calling someone an idiot, you could say:

    • “I don’t think you’ve thought this through.”
    • “I want you to research this more before deciding.”
    • (Or, the hardest one to say.) “I know you’re smart and I think you’ve been fed false information.”

     

    This will probably be difficult.  But information that comes with ego-wounding remarks are more likely to be rejected with the message itself.  Information that comes with ego-boosting respect is more likely to be well-received and influence.

     

    The objective isn’t to fight their ego, but to make the change that aligns with your goal.

     

    ———

     

    Conclusion: Anger as a Relateful Skill

     

    Anger doesn’t have to be uncaring.  When integrated maturely, anger is a tool of love.

     

    The work is not to let go of anger in favor of sadness, but to develop the skill to use anger for good–to soften it to manageable levels, clarify its goals, and keep it aimed on the right path without letting impulses to hurt take over.

     

    Relateful anger includes humanization of the other, confronts with honesty without burning bridges, and creates the conditions for influential change.

     

    ———

     

    Originality Statement

     

    This work is original, has not been published elsewhere, and represents the author’s own thinking and experience.

     

    Conflicts of Interest.

     

    None.

     

    Permissions

     

    Any illustrative examples are hypothetical.

     

    Resources

     

    • Us: Getting Past Me and You to Build a More Loving Relationship by Terrence Real
    Shane.OrtoninROAR: Research in Applied Relatefulness - Journal Submissions & discussion•...
    I’m mainly curious about how people react to this modeling of anger.  I have a relationship with anger that started from fear of my father’s anger and transformed through relating to my own anger (especially in sports)....
    family dynamics
    psychology
    anger management
    sports psychology
    Comments
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  • M

    Hell is Praying and Heaven is Bullshitting. Every now and then, one finds oneself in a cosmic struggle between two truths that have a hard time being seen at once.  I've been in one of those for a few years, and thought I would try to describe what I see from my current position.

    A story to help illustrate it: I was talking with a good friend of mine a few years ago, and he described a feeling that he was stuck in a pit, trying to get out, and asking others for help, and kept getting back this message to the effect of "you're doing this to yourself.  we can't help you until you decide to stop doing it to yourself." There was a sense that he was unworthy of even being considered for help without somehow changing first.

    And I said: yeah.  I see you in the pit.  And on behalf of the universe, *we are doing what we can* to help you out of the pit, without you needing to fix yourself first. You are not unworthy.  And also, our capacity is very limited right now—including that some people themselves are still confused about all this.  And so to the extent that you CAN help yourself out of your pits, even a little, that helps bridge the gap and helps us help you.  But if we knew how, we would meet you fully, exactly where you are, without demanding anything.

    This view of mine was hard-won, having spent years struggling with a similar issue only to suddenly have this insight where I GOT that the kosmos contained a force that fully wanted to meet me where I was at, and I could tell that it did because *I was a participant in that force*—I could feel its will flow through me, in my desire to meet others where they were at. (And sometimes parts of me are others to other parts of me.). 

    And yet, over the years, both before and after this insight, I have tasted the other side of it.  I've gotten glimmers of the truth in C.S. Lewis's “the doors of hell are locked on the inside.” I've felt strain and struggle suddenly shift into eternal boundless perfection—perfection that, when I look in the rearview mirror, was there the whole time, through the struggle. I've lost count of how many times I've arrived in such a place.  And there was truth to “nobody else could do it for me”, truth that it involved letting go of my grievances without trying to sort them all out first, and truth that that loving presence was always there holding me and supporting me and rooting for me.

    There's truth to this, but when we go back and connect it to my friends’ story: what the fuck?  Something has gotten confused.  You can *obviously* be helped, in many ways, some of which have never been conceived of by anybody ever. Even if you only think that conveying the message of the need for someone to choose their way out can help, and nothing material can...  if the message is not getting through clearly, there are literally infinite possible ways to rephrase it or to convey it through not just word but example or gesture. I have definitely been helped, and I have no reason to think that the amount that I've been helped is somehow the perfect maximum theoretically possible (even if it was as much as was possible at the time).

    A stance that says "there is nothing I can do to help you with your suffering", no matter how noble and righteous and  it presents itself, is its own hell.  It’s a stance of victimhood.  And it’s bullshit.  It’s failing to own your own limitations: *I* have run out of ideas, or patience to keep talking with you.  *I* cannot maintain my own groundedness while meeting you in your pit.  *I* do not have a rope long enough to reach you, but I would if I could.  And I can’t promise I’ll be back with a longer rope, but I sure hope someone can.

    And I feel like many times I have been offered the choice to step out of the hell of overt grievance and into this other more subtle hell, that leaves me feeling forever alienated in relation to people I see as choosing to recreate their grievance hells.  Hell, sometimes I’ve even tried to take the option, but it didn’t stick for me.

    Hell’s Prayer—“help me, show me I am worthy without me having to change”—kept coming back and demanding an answer.  “It always does, and is never satisfied,” Heaven’s Bullshit will warn you. And there’s wisdom there. And yet.  There’s also a skill issue.  I can tell that there is a more satisfying answer to Hell’s Prayer than that, and I am not giving up on finding it.  One that still doesn't require letting Hell hold you hostage.  There is a better Heaven, without this bullshit.  

    As you can see: I have found my way to a stance that can at least hold that there is wisdom in both of these views, even if I can’t integrate them.  The tension exists internally to me.  As you can also see: I tend to find myself playing out the pole of Hell’s Prayer, in thinking about the topic or in relating to others.

    This sucks!  It sucks to find myself bound to taking a stand for “no, I will not let go of this, I will simply complain until the day I die or the day someone says ‘yes, your complaint is valid’ and manages to say it so clearly and fully and honestly and tangibly... that I can put that complaint to rest.”  But the only other option I see from here is to adopt Heaven’s Bullshit, and…  well, for me that isn’t even really an option at this point.

    It would be nice to integrate this tension internally, to sort it all out in myself and be able to meet the Bright People of Heaven and rather than complain and demand they change in order to drag me out of my pit, to calmly and patiently offer “it seems like you’re confused here, and you’re suffering unnecessarily because of it”.  But I fear that if I did, they would say “see, you sorted this out yourself, as I always told you you had to” and would only get the message to persist in their confusion.

    And yet.  Their pits may be comfier than mine, but I will not give up in my search for suitable ladders.  I will rest though, on the path.

    #DeepTake #DeepTakes

    TrustTheJourney•...
    This is an interesting topic — one I’ve wrestled with for many years. Over time, I’ve learned something important: I can’t change the world’s problems, and the world isn’t obligated to care about me....
    family dynamics
    self improvement
    relationships
    personal boundaries
    Comments
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  • F

    Engage or Enrage. It is likely that we have family members or friends that we differ with greatly when it comes to politics, healthcare, etc.  I am no different.  When the inevitable hot topic arises, do you recommend flight or fight, engage or enrage?  How do you respond when this occurs?

    FrankieBoy•...

    Have spoken to so many family members about how their votes have affected my wellbeing and who I am.  They won't demonize a family member.... most of the time

    family dynamics
    politics
    Comments
    0
  • F

    Engage or Enrage. It is likely that we have family members or friends that we differ with greatly when it comes to politics, healthcare, etc.  I am no different.  When the inevitable hot topic arises, do you recommend flight or fight, engage or enrage?  How do you respond when this occurs?

    KC2sunshine•...
    I really hate to say it, but ever since Trump was elected in 2016, i've had to take the fight and enrage options, but only because I had no other choices.  have a strained relationship with my Father-in-Law at best when it comes to this topic....
    family dynamics
    relationships
    politics
    Comments
    0
  • F

    Engage or Enrage. It is likely that we have family members or friends that we differ with greatly when it comes to politics, healthcare, etc.  I am no different.  When the inevitable hot topic arises, do you recommend flight or fight, engage or enrage?  How do you respond when this occurs?

    TanTanWaWa•...

    I think my family is good at flight. We were kind of taught to be insular in our beliefs. Shunning isn't unusual. I've accepted I won't be invited to the party.

    family dynamics
    social behavior
    belief systems
    Comments
    0
  • F

    Engage or Enrage. It is likely that we have family members or friends that we differ with greatly when it comes to politics, healthcare, etc.  I am no different.  When the inevitable hot topic arises, do you recommend flight or fight, engage or enrage?  How do you respond when this occurs?

    FrankieBoy•...
    I have utilized two different strategies with two different family members.  My brother has become so angry that I chose not to engage for the sake of family unity.  My BIL, used to send me emails full of his talking points....
    family dynamics
    political discourse
    communication strategies
    Comments
    0
  • A

    What men wish women understood about men. This has been trigger a lot LOLs and ROFLs in my group chats. It's obviously over-the-top dramatic with the music and tone and hyperbolic "10,000x" language but it did make me think how much "burden" is kept when you don't talk about things. I think that's the basic premise, woman share their burdens and men keep them to themselves. It certainly tracks for me. 

    https://x.com/chriswillx/status/1957789651621523918?s=46
    jordanSA•...

    also Stephanie comments on how I'm harder on Jack than Ciça, so it's interesting to see some of the roots of this developing, and so early

    family dynamics
    parenting styles
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  • jordan avatar

    What are some of your uncertainties? Experiences of failure (that maybe you still haven't turned into learnings yet?) Obvious realizations? (eg: things that were maybe super obvious to others, or even obvious to you about others, but you just realized deeply apply to you?) 

    Will you share some here in the comments?

    #quicktakes 

    jordanSA•...
    Impossible premises, perfectionism, and nothing to forgive 🤦 The other night I got so angry at my kids; they would not go to sleep.  “Shh, no more talking,” I whisper to Jack....
    family dynamics
    psychology
    parenting
    self-improvement
    Comments
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  • B

    Schizophrenics on social media. I think that as emotions change it must be seen that at time when one felt angry at the world or sad. It came out on your posts on social media however when the good days come that can also come on social media so social media is a proof how at first how you thought with all the posts you were sending and then next when you feel better how do you talk and post then.

    If facebook is a place where people’s negativity is coming out. ok then when one is feeling more in control of ones emotions then a graduate gift could be to come into UPTrust. Where we are open to having dialogues where we can disagree in a peaceful manner yet try and understand where the other person is coming from. Instead of being boisterous or loud. We must accept others beliefs even if its different from our own and we still can be friends. You do what you want I do what I want yet we are together in harmony. Our friendship doesn’t end. But we must respect each other for the choices we are making as what feels right to us we will do even though others have their opinions. What I want for myself must be respected.

    dara_like_saraSAinreimagining social media with nithya shanti•...
    My family most often falls into that bucket. However, I usually have a much greater opportunity to see nuance with family. My relative who still staunchly refers to the Washington Commanders as the "Redskins" is the same one who would never miss a graduation, wedding, or funeral...
    family dynamics
    relationships
    personal reflection
    Comments
    0
  • nithya avatar

    More on Indian Marriages. I’m wondering if any of you have insights on how Indian Marriages can be more meaningful.

    I find that they are usually very formulaic with few opportunities for genuine connection and interaction. It seems to be mostly about completing certain prescribed rituals.

    I’m sure there are exceptions to this norm, however most weddings I have attended have been mostly about dressing up, getting photos taken, eating 🍽️, and some joking / teasing.

    If I had to create something different it would include the following:

    1. The bride and groom share their hopes and dreams and fears and aspirations.
    2. There is an occasion to get to know a little bit about the main members of both sides of the family.
    3. An opportunity for people to share some of their talents and gifts.
    4. Occasion for blessing the couple with words / poems / short plays and other creative ways.
    5. Those who wish to can share their most important relationship wisdom / anecdotes / Learnings.
    6. Less money spent on the fancy aspects of the wedding and more on creating an atmosphere that is welcoming and puts people at easy.
    7. Maybe a quiz / trivia about the couple and the respective families.

    I know this is me imposing my value system on what is a well established tradition. However I felt like sharing my reflections and I welcome your insights.

    Thanks.

    Divyainreimagining social media with nithya shanti•...
    I loved your ideas, Nithya. I dread going to marriages, as I already have a preconceived notion that it’s going to be a tense, morose affair. And this notion has been built basis the few that I have witnessed....
    family dynamics
    relationships
    weddings
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  • jordan avatar

    Your parents are massively successful if you are more evolved/mature than they are. I hope Jack and Cecilia surpass me in emotional intelligence, wellness, rationality.

    I hope I’m humble enough to recognize it, but I hope they’re more developed even if I can’t and it feels painful to me.

    annabeth•...
    Renee, here’s my current theory on the form of guilting your mom seems to be using: People at Amber are still actively rejecting the flagrant domination of Red, but they still want extremely strict boundaries....
    family dynamics
    psychology
    interpersonal relationships
    Comments
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  • jordan avatar

    Some Thoughts on Boundaries. Boundaries are mine. My portals to connection. They’re statements of fact: “whoops, I’m sorry, it turns out I can’t love from here anymore.”

    The purest form doesn’t require anyone else to uphold. I can say “no” to a party I don’t want to go to. I can turn off my phone at bedtime. Asking someone not to interrupt me or not answering emails after work can feel a little trickier to uphold, because I have to be willing to walk away.

    There are a bunch of socially agreed upon boundaries that are upheld by law enforcement, like cease and desists or restraining orders. It’s often not simple—in Texas I have a right to refuse anyone setting foot on my property (but what about racism, when my property is a business?).

    There are some thoughts for now...

    jordanSA•...

    I missed this a few months back—i’m glad no one else does, but also I’m sorry your mom yells at you! How’s it feel?

    family dynamics
    personal relationships
    emotional well-being
    Comments
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  • J

    Envy and desire. I’ve been studying quite intensively with Kasia Urbaniak this summer. One thing she’s focusing on is something she calls emotional alchemy: moving emotions and cooking them so that they can lead us towards what we want. One example she talks about is turning envy into desire. When we feel envy towards another person it shows us what we really want, and in fighting that person we subconsciously tell ourselves we can’t have what they have, but in blessing them and befriending them and learning from them we get to move closer to having what they have.

    I like the concept and I’ve tried it a few times where it’s led me to claim more of myself. It’s actually been quite transformative in a few relationships too, but specifically it’s helped me to not be stuck in envy.

    What do y’all think about it?

    jordanSA•...
    It sounds really good, and it sounds like it’s had good effects on you! I personally very rarely feel envy (or jealousy). It’s possible that’s because I was so thoroughly encouraged and told that I could have whatever I want as a child, given I’m willing to put in the effort to...
    family dynamics
    personal development
    psychology
    mental health
    self-help
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  • valerie@relateful.com avatar

    Being Out of Sync in a Group Meeting. I was just in a meeting that I was leading where, almost every time I spoke, someone else spoke at the same time. The other person would continue speaking and I would stop. It was as if my timing was wrong; I was out of sync with the group. I imagine there were a number of things going on. One is that I was holding the list of topics to talk about as if we needed to get through all of them in the time we had, while the group wanted to savor and speak to each item at length. But it wasn’t just that. Within a topic, I was always bumping against someone else, timing wise. It felt awful. Any ideas or comments about this phenomena?

    annabeth•...
    I’m pretty sure I was at the meeting you’re talking about, seems fun to look at it from this angle, and I have theories. For most of that meeting we felt to me like we were in an estended-family-playing-games-together vibe of playfulness, which in my family has a lot of jumping...
    family dynamics
    psychology
    group dynamics
    interpersonal communication
    meeting management
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  • jordan avatar

    Monogamy v polyamory. Is monogamy better? Is poly better? Is there an overall norm for people, with exceptions? Is it totally pluralistic? Here are some points for monogamy, with some counter points, to convey some of my uncertainty but nevertheless leaning into what I’ve chosen:

    • Point: I don’t know a single polyamorous couple that’s lasted more than a decade, whereas I know a ton of lifelong monogamous couples.
      • Counterpoint: many of the lifelong monogamous couples are not healthy relationships
        • Counter-counter-point: perhaps being in a lifelong commitment, even if the relationship isn’t ideal, is more healthy than being hyper-independent, especially as you get older. This runs right up against boundaries, how to know what to tolerate/love as is, when to leave, etc
    • Point: The poly focus of attention tends to be the relationships themselves, often a kind of relational narcissism, rather than the relationship being a foundation for engaging the world in love (ironically). This is my version of the poly is impractical argument. Most of the people I meet practicing polyamory are constantly putting tons and tons and tons of life energy into their relational problems, and it seems like their relationships are often built around addressing these problems rather than enjoying life together. The fact that it takes so much time and energy points to something being a little off. Monogamous relating also takes energy but it usually seems less self-referential; they’re more often helping each other face and engage the world, rather than face and engage each other and their relationship.
      • potential counterpoint: You’re making a developmental point Jordan, not a mono/poly point. Most people practice poly from a Red ego-centric POV; most people practice sex from Red as well. If you practice from a genuine Green+ polyamory, this doesn’t happen.
    • Point: Humans are largely monogamous; it’s instinctual
      • Counterpoint: How would we know if its cultural versus biological versus systemic versus psychological per person/family? it only takes a couple of generations of evolution to make massive physical changes, so even if it is biological, how could we know what’s possible for the future?
      • Counterpoint: people wanna fuck, especially dudes
      • Cheating, mistresses, polygamy, Sex at Dawn etc…
    • Point: Many poly people avoid endings, boundaries, standards, and facing their own karma by just jumping from relationships to relationship. Sure monogamous people do too, but many of them end up getting married and that crucible forces them to face their stuff. Far fewer poly people get married, and when they do they can still use other relationships to avoid their shit
      • Counterpoint: we can use absolutely everything to avoid our shit.

    there’s tons more, just want to get the convo started…

    jordanSA•...
    very cool, thanks for sharing. I haven’t heard people make such a strong stand about these specifics of "unethical polyamory" and I appreciate it, even though I haven’t thought about it long enough to have a strong opinion....
    ethics
    family dynamics
    relationships
    polyamory
    honesty
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  • jordan avatar

    What are your sci-fi TV show recommendations? Some i loved that jump to mind:

    • The Expanse
    • Most of the Marvel stuff like Loki, What If?
    • Rick and Morty
    • Legends of Tomorrow Etc
    jordanSA•...
    You being charismatic, can easily set a frame and my guess is people mostly step right into it. I imagine you have some attention on that. Yes! I was just talking about this with a Level Upper....
    family dynamics
    psychology
    interpersonal relationships
    communication skills
    self-improvement
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  • jordan avatar

    What are your sci-fi TV show recommendations? Some i loved that jump to mind:

    • The Expanse
    • Most of the Marvel stuff like Loki, What If?
    • Rick and Morty
    • Legends of Tomorrow Etc
    jordanSA•...
    How do you get caught in your mom-in-law’s construct? Mostly through being naive or ignorant… I take things at face value, and then I realize there was more being smuggled in....
    family dynamics
    psychology
    interpersonal relationships
    communication
    personal boundaries
    Comments
    0
  • brian avatar

    How i decieded to stop sharing my feelings with my mom. one time when i was 17, my mom took me to Baltimore (like an hour and a half away) to help me get my driving learner’s permit. it was a special DMV with extra long lines, because i was not a citizen. the process took many hours of just sitting there (this was before smartphones), and I was incredibly bored. My mom asked me how i was feeling, and I told her I was bored.

    Then she got super mad and said that it was wrong of me to be bored. that she spent the whole day helping me with this and how dare I say I’m bored. the whole drive back she was ranting non-stop about how ungrateful we are - for some reason she got mad at Emma too, my sister (not her real name), even though she wasn’t there. she kept saying we were not grateful to her and were super entitled.

    She kept saying, wait till we get home and Emma hears what you said, she’s gonna be mad at you too I pretended to fall asleep in the car so that I wouldn’t have to keep hearing her.
    Eventually we got home, and she told Emma and she was like ummm, yeah, of course he was bored and sided with me.
    My mom stormed off angry. I decided that day to never again be honest with with my mom about my feelings

    jordanSA•...
    Man my heart breaks for you hearing this. To feel like you’re honestly answering a question and be blindsided by such fury and judgement must have felt like a betrayal, and a deep invalidation. Like c’mon, what was she thinking?! That you can make yourself feel a different way?...
    family dynamics
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    emotional intelligence
    parenting
    immigrant experience
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  • X

    New structures for family-friends? Chatting with a friend recently and came up with this novel idea.

    Historically, many people would end up married, having kids, and having responsibilities to their family and local community and groups.

    These days, we have less family and civic integrity, less people are having kids. More people are creating their family of choice with friends.

    I think there’s a general love and aliveness everyone wants to express and be in connection with.

    But without the usual routes of kids/religion/local community, it doesn’t get routed well anymore.

    We need more structures/ideas/understanding to support new kinds of families and community structures.

    Examples:
    How about an app that makes it easier to crowd source among trusted local friends to babysit?

    Most housing is built around one nuclear family 1-4 bedrooms. But what about community homes with larger kitchens and living rooms and smaller but more bedrooms?

    I’m gesturing at this general area at the idea that modern, industrial civilization is built around nuclear families but we have a lot more forms being generated now but still lagging behind in the idea/social practice/phys infrastructure to match.

    annabeth•...
    I can imagine UpTrust being able to meet the babysit-type thing very easily. And I used to live in one of those community homes for 3 years. It was definitely cool in a ton of ways, and it meant I had just about the least lonely Covid around....
    family dynamics
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    voting systems
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  • Philip avatar

    Trump is now…. ..officially a convicted criminal. And he’s still going to run. And he’s probably still going to win.

    I’m not quite sure what that says about the state of democracy, the Biden administration, the US and/or our world.

    But it strikes me as so utterly absurd, it’s actually kinda hilarious.

    I remember 8 years ago, I was so appalled when Trump got elected, it seemed like the end of the world.

    But the world didn’t end. And it might be my heartbroken disappointment with Biden’s warmongering-while-virtue-signaling administration or the fact that whoever’s actually in control of the Democratic party seems to just not give a fuck and is willing to run him again when he seems at least half-senile, but this time around I’m like, yeah, OK, Trump again. Fine. Bring it on.

    (Insert gif of person eating popcorn ).

    jordanSA•...
    for Presidential stuff, I’m quite selective on who I feel safe enough to share this perspective with me too! Even with my sister and parents, whom I used to talk about politics pretty openly with, I just don’t really go into it anymore....
    family dynamics
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    politics
    self-reflection
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